After a while, the discussion turned (I turned it) to whether the students had ever said “I love you” to their parents or heard their parents say “I love you” to them. The overwhelming majority said “no” to both. They said that they knew their parents love them because of all the sacrifices they’ve made, but they’ve never heard them say “I love you.”

I said, “But in songs it’s always ‘wǒ ài nǐ 我爱你 this’ and ‘wǒ ài nǐ 我爱你 that’, right?”

They agreed it’s common in songs, and lovers might say that occasionally to each other, but it’s rarely said between parents and children.

Then one student said, “My parents will say ‘wǒ hěn téng nǐ 我很疼你’, but never ‘wǒ hěn ài nǐ 我很爱你’.”

Ok, just to put closure on my cheap, shock-value title, “téng 疼” really does mean “to love” in addition to being the same character for “hurt” (although, I’m pretty sure it can’t be used transitively for “to hurt” the way I did in the title). What was interesting to me was: when I asked them in English “Do your parents say ‘I love you’”, they (most of them) shook their heads. But later when the student said her parents say ‘wǒ hěn téng nǐ 我很疼你’, they (most of them) agreed with that.

So, questions for the reader(s):

1. What does that ‘wǒ hěn téng nǐ 我很疼你’ REALLY mean? Is it really just another way of saying “I love you”? If not, what’s the difference?
2. (For our Chinese reader): How prevalent is this phenomenon? Is it true that parents prefer to use the word “téng 疼” over “ài 爱”?

If you’ve got answers or theories, please enlighten us.

• A Simple Song
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• Beware of False Friends

Bù le 不了 = No thanks (I don’t want to do something)

It’s not really “no thanks,” because there’s no xiè 谢 in there, but it does mean “no” and I get the feeling it’s used in situations where we would say “no thanks.”

Apparently, it’s best used between friends or someone you can speak informally with rather than shop owners or your boss. Here are the two situations in which I’ve heard it used:

1. A friend on her balcony waving to a friend walking past:

A: Nǐ yào bú yào shàng lái hē chá? 你要不要上来喝茶?
Do you want to come up and have some tea?

B: Bù le. Wǒ huí qù le. 不了. 我回去了.
No thanks. I’m going home.

As I understand it, in this situation “bù le” 不了 is short for “bú yòng le” 不用了 meaning “that’s not necessary.” But that explanation doesn’t really help me because if I were inviting you for tea, I wouldn’t assume it was necessary. Again, that’s why I translate it as “no thanks.”

2. Two friends (A and B) chatting at a sidewalk cafe. A third friend (C) walks past.

A: Nǐ hǎo! Gēn wǒmen yìqǐ chīfàn ba. 你好！跟我们一起吃饭吧.
Hi! Eat with us.

C: Bù le. Wǒ yǐjīng chī le. 不了. 我已经吃了.
No thanks. I already ate.

Notice in both situations they are friends. Also notice that “bù le” 不了 is immediately followed by a jièkǒu 借口 of some sort.

Does anyone else have some insight into this little nugget? Please enlighten us.

• Hey, That’s Cheating! OK?
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• Beware of False Friends
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• Gesture Phobia

In an attempt to stay topical and current in my English classes leading up to China’s liùshí zhōunián guóqìng 六十周年国庆 (and I’m talking zhōusuì 周岁, by the way), I’ve let the students discuss various related subjects in our class such as what will happen this year to celebrate the founding of the country and what changes the country has gone through in the past 60 years.

(As a side note, I was stumped, again, when a student said that part of the celebration will be yuèbīng 阅兵 and didn’t know how to say it in English. Knowing full well that Zhōngqiūjié 中秋节 will be right in the middle of this year’s Guóqìngjié 国庆节 I proudly announced that the most common translation is “moon cakes.” Never before has the class been so active. “Not yuèbǐng 月饼, we’re talking about yuèbīng 阅兵!” they shouted as I suppressed every instinct I had to launch into a rant about the tones and listening comprehension. Breathe. Yes. It’s OK.)

One of the discussion questions was:

“What do the stars on the guóqí 国旗 stand for?”

I really wanted to know. It’s my fifth year enjoying the not-really-a-whole-week-of-vacation-because-we-have-to-make-up-classes-on-the-weekends, so it’s high time I learned that little factoid.

The big star is certainly the Communist Party (Gòngchǎndǎng 共产党). But surprisingly, the students (in every class) couldn’t agree on what the four small stars stand for. So out came the shǒujī-s 手机 with their mobile internet browsers and that’s when the debate finally got rolling.

One student was adamant that the four yellow stars stand for:

1. nóngmín 农民 = farmers
2. gōngrén 工人 = workers
3. lǎoshī 老师 = teachers
4. xuésheng 学生 = students

The other students approved farmers and workers but vehemently shot down teachers and students.

That lead the first student to go online and immediately prove herself wrong by reporting that she is now equally sure that they are:

1. nóngmín 农民 = farmers
2. gōngrén 工人 = workers
3. xiǎo zīchǎn jiējí 小资产阶级 = petty bourgeois
4. mínzú zīchǎn jiējí 民族资产阶级 = national bourgeois?? ethnic bourgeois??

She probably found this baidu page, which is a sort of Yahoo-Answers-style forum in which people vote for the answer that seems the best. The above currently has 134 thumbs up (and also seems to agree with the site I borrowed that flag picture from).

I’m not super clear on what those English terms mean, but that site claims they are four social classes. Um, well, I don’t know quite how to say this but, isn’t the idea of different classes um, well, different from the whole idea of the big star? I’m not saying it’s wrong. I’m just saying I don’t understand. [insert hands-up, palms-forward emoticon here]

Later, a student staring at his phone proudly announced that he’d found the answer:

1. nóngmín 农民 = farmers
2. gōngrén 工人 = workers
3. shìbīng 士兵 = soldiers
4. zhīshí fènzi 知识分子 = intellectuals
5. qīngnián 青年 = youth

I came home and did a Google search to find where he got his info. Result number one took me to this baidu site , which has the same list.

My suspicions were immediately aroused when I saw a) there are actually five groups, and b) the “Vietnamese Communist party” made an appearance or two. Upon closer reading, I found that despite the the phrase “Chinese flag” in the header of the article, that little biadu post is actually about what each of the five points of the star on the Vietnamese (and maybe Chinese) flag stands for. Apparently my student didn’t realize that and just reported the first list he found that started with farmers and workers.

Everyone agrees on farmers and workers, but the other two stars are still up for grabs. So, I’m going to have a little contest.

The first person to explain what the 4 little stars stand for (and give an authoritative source) wins the prize.

The prize: I’ll cancel that box of moon cakes I’m planning to send you.

Friendly reminder: This is strictly a language-focused, non-political blog. Please avoid comments that will get me banned in China. Thanks!

• Parents Hurt Rather Than Love Their Children
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But what ever does it mean to us learning Chinese? I’m not going to pretend I know the answer. All I’m saying is the Chinese seem to associate flowers with girls and and grass with boys. Oh…um…and sometimes flowers with boys too. Flowers and grass make appearances in the language of love (and it’s not always bāoyì 褒义).

A few examples:

• xiàohuā 校花 = prettiest girl in school [school flower]
• xiàocǎo 校草 = most handsome boy in school [school grass]

(apparently you can replace “xiào” 校 with “bān” 班 to mean “prettiest girl/boy in the class”)

• huā húdié 花蝴蝶 = social butterfly (girl) [flower butterfly]
• huāxīn 花心 = playboy / playgirl (but it’s an adjective!) [flower heart]
• huāhuā gōngzi 花花公子 = play boy [flower-flower prince]

Also, I think that if Chinese people see a written name of someone they’ve never met and it contains that flower character (huā 花), they’ll assume it’s a girl’s name. Would the same be true of grass (cǎo 草) in a boy’s name? (Where’s my Chinese name bank?!)

And one final use of grass and flower in an exceedingly, long two-line proverb/saying/idiom thingy:

tiānyá héchù wú fāng cǎo 天涯何处无芳草
= There is a lot of fragrant grass in the world

hébì dānliàn yì zhī huā 何必单恋一枝花
= There’s no reason why unrequited love should be a single flower

I’ve been told it means “There are plenty of fish in the sea” (you know, after someone has been rejected by a lover).

Are all of these pretty widely used in your part of China? Anyone else know of any flowery/grassy idioms or phrases we can add to this list? Please do share.

• Wanted: Chinese Name Gender Reference
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This post started out innocently enough as a fun way to test the new audio plugin (thanks to Beijing Sounds for the tip) and celebrate the joy of speaking a foreign language. But in the end (as you’ll see at the end) I ended up documenting some bona fide “tone fudging” by a real, live, Chinese native speaker. So, don’t touch that dial!

First, here are some things that roll so nicely off the tongue that I’m constantly looking for excuses to say them.

Top 4 Favorite Things to Say in Chinese:

Tech support note: If anyone is having trouble playing these audio files, please let me know and I’ll try to figure out what’s going on.

4. guàibude 怪不得 = No wonder

[See original post to listen to audio]

Of course you can also say, “nánguài” 难怪, which may actually get used more by real Chinese people, but where’s the fun in that?

3. chàbuduō 差不多 = more or less, almost, nearly

[See original post to listen to audio]

In addition to helping you accomplish all your equivocating goals, it’s useful with an added “le” 了 to mean:

[See original post to listen to audio]

chàbuduō le 差不多了 = That’s about enough (stop giving me rice / time to go home now, etc.)

2. suàn le ba 算了吧 = forget it / never mind

[See original post to listen to audio]

Here’s an example where you could use it with or without the “ba” 吧:

A: yǒu méiyǒu hóngsè de? 有没有红色的? = Do you have a red one?
B: méiyǒu 没有 = No.
A: suàn le (ba) 算了(吧) = Ok, never mind / forget it then.

Now, “méi guānxi” 没关系 also means “never mind” but it can also mean “it doesn’t make any difference.” If you really only want a red one (let’s say a lamp) then “suàn le ba” gets you out of buying one. But if you say “méi guānxi” it may imply that the color isn’t that important and you might still be interested in a white one.

But, as if our lives weren’t bitter enough, here’s an extremely confusing situation where “suàn le” 算了 means the opposite:

A: zhège duōshao qián? 这个多少钱? = How much does this cost?
B: wǔshíwǔ kuài 五十五块 = 55 yuan.
A: wǔshí kěyǐ ma? 五十可以吗? = 50, ok?
B: suàn le, suàn le 算了算了 = Ok, ok (it’s a deal).

The best way I can think of to explain this is: if the buyer says “suàn le” 算了, it means he doesn’t want it. But if the seller says “suàn le” 算了 to a price, it means it’s acceptable. I’d love to hear someone else take a crack at clarifying why that is.

1. niǔ niǔ niē niē 扭扭捏捏 = to be fake shy / to hesitate

[See original post to listen to audio]

While opportunities to say this are rare, it’s got to be the most fun thing to say in Chinese I’ve found so far. It literally means “twist twist pinch pinch” (again, someone please explain why).

To use it to scold your students for taking too long to decide who’s going to speak first in a dialog, you can add the imperative “don’t want”:

[See original post to listen to audio]

bú yào niǔ niǔ niē niē 不要扭扭捏捏 = don’t pretend to be shy

BONUS: Tone Fudging

You may have noticed that “niǔ niǔ niē niē” becomes “niú niǔ niē niē.” That’s codified. The ol’ “two 3rd tones becomes a 2nd and a 3rd” rule. But did you notice what happened to the “bú yào”?

When I recorded my informant saying the above phrase, I noticed a very interesting little phenomenon: she doesn’t say “bú yào” 不要 with a second and fourth tone like we’ve been told we’re supposed to. Instead, it sounds like “bǔ yáo” or maybe “bú yáo.”

I asked her if I heard that right and she said she could also do it the other “standard” way, but that the tone of voice (yǔqì 语气) would be different (she explains it all at the end of this post).

Here’s the standard way:

[See original post to listen to audio]

bú yào niǔ niǔ niē niē

Now, let’s listen to the first way followed directly by this “standard” way:

[See original post to listen to audio]

1. bǔ yáo niǔ niǔ niē niē

2. bú yào niǔ niǔ niē niē

And just for kicks, only the “bu yao’s” in isolation, repeated to really shine the spotlight on the phenomenon (sorry the “n” of “niu” is at the end of each–it sounds like “bu yaon” but we can deal with that, right?):

[See original post to listen to audio]

1. bǔ yáo

2. bú yào

Here’s her explanation of the difference:

[See original post to listen to audio]

“bǔ yáo niǔniǔniēniē” jiùshì bǐjiào kǒuyǔhuà de.
“不要扭扭捏捏”就是比较口语化的.
“[the first way]” is relatively colloquial.

yǔqì méi nàme zhòng.
语气没那么重.
The tone of voice isn’t that serious.

“bú yào niǔniǔniēniē” jiùshì yǒu yìdiǎn shēngqì de gǎnjué.
“不要扭扭捏捏”就是有一点生气的感觉.
“[the second way]” has a little bit of an angry feeling.

So there you have it, straight from a native speaker’s mouth. It opens up a whole new discussion called, “Well, how do we know what tones can be fudged to express feelings?” The short answer: we don’t, only they do.

I can’t help but think that this would have been called “Zhonglish” if it had come from a foreigner. But since it’s from a native speaker, it’s bona fide, acceptable Chinese. I’m sure there’s a lot more tone fudging going on with native speakers than we know about. I hope to get some more examples. Maybe I’ll start a whole new post category on it! Regardless, this is the first empirical evidence that what I wrote in Tone Wars isn’t as cut and dried as I originally thought.

• Better Mandarin Tones Diagram
• Why Is Nǎlǐ 哪里 Written Wrong?
• Tone Wars
• Where do I put the tone marks in pinyin words?
• Tone Changes

Culture

1. First year for official holiday. While Qingming Jie is thousands of years old, this is the first year (2008) that it has been an official, government holiday from school and work. I asked my students to theorize why that may be. They sited the following possible factors:

• The May holiday has been shortened to one day (from three previously) which has freed up more holidays to be given to other festivals.
• “Korea has stolen Dragon Boat Festival” and the Chinese don’t want to see that happen with any other rightfully Chinese traditional holidays. (here’s an article that touches on the conflict which seems to have something to do with World Heritage listings).

If anyone else has any theories, I’d love to hear them.

2. For boys, not girls. While some towns allow girls to participate, the tomb sweeping responsibilities are usually for the men of the family.

3. More important in South than North. Apparently, some of my students from northern China didn’t even know what Qingming Jie was. Can anyone up north confirm or deny that this is a trend and not just my students?

Vocabulary

If you talk to any Chinese people about their home town’s traditions for Qingming Jie, you may run across some of this vocab. These are words I was asked “how to say…” so often that I actually learned the Chinese for them in the process.

fénmù 坟墓 = tomb / grave

mùdì 墓地 = cemetery (which sounds exactly like mùdì 目的 = “goal”)

sǎomù 扫墓 = to sweep tombs

bài zǔxiān 拜祖先 = to pay respects to ancestors

shāo xiāng 烧香 = to burn incense

shāo zhū 烧猪 = roast pig

gānzhè 甘蔗 = sugar cane

fàng biānpào 放鞭炮 = set off firecrackers

If you want to know the significance of these things, you’ll have to ask your Chinese informants (or find an article online). If there are some other useful (and confirmed by a native speaker) words I’ve left off, please feel free to share them with us.

• Northern vs. Southern Vocab
• Pinch Sounds Like It Is
• Beware of False Friends
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• New Internet Slang: Mù yǒu 木有

At 7:39 in the MP3 file, Jenny and John have his exchange:

Jenny: John, nǐ jīngcháng zhèiyàng làngfèi dàjiā de gǎnqíng, shì ba?
你经常这样浪费大家的, 感情?
John, you often waste everyon’e emotion like this, right?

John: xièxie.
谢谢.
Thanks.

Jenny: (laughing) Búguò, wǒ juéde jīntiān de duìhuà hěn yǒu yìsi. wǒmen zài tīng yì biān.
不过, 我觉得今天的对话很有意思. 我们在听一遍.
Anyway, I think today’s dialog is very interesting. Let’s listen again.

I had to ask a Chinese friend to confirm that’s what Jenny actually said because it’s reduced to what sounds like “buo.” But there’s no doubt: that’s what she said, and that’s what she means. I’ve added “anyway” as a definition for “buguo” in the online dictionary.

If you want to know what all that talk about “wasting emotion” is, you’ll have to listen to the whole Chinesepod lesson.

I can’t wait to go out and start saying “anyway” all the time in Chinese.

• Doubt: Harder Than You’d Suspect
• Better Mandarin Tones Diagram
• Read Chinese (NFLC) – My Review
• Chinese Grammar Wiki – First Impressions
• Stuff You Might Be Hearing: On the Bus

The ways we use “anyway” as a kind of sentence starter in English are:

1. To end a topic and move on to a new one. For example, at the end of a story about the milk truck we might say, “…the milk truck finally rolled away. Anyway, do you teach tomorrow?” (This “anyway” is often accompanied by a sigh.)
2. To return to a previous topic after a digression. For example, if I’m talking about the milk truck and suddenly my story wanders off to my new computer, to get back to the milk truck story I would say, “…my new computer. Anyway, the milk truck driver had this red hat…” (This is really along the same vein as number one in this list.)
3. To mean, “regardless.” For example, if I’m not sure whether I’ll be free to play ping pong tonight, I could explain the different things in my schedule that might interfere. Then I would say, “Anyway, I’ll call you when I know more.”

There may be even more uses of “anyway” in English but those are the three that come to mind.

I’ve asked a number of informants how to say “anyway” in Chinese and it seems that you have to choose the function from the list above, and use a different word/phrase depending on the situation.

For example, for function 1 above, they might say:

• suàn le ba 算了吧 = forget it (let’s move on)
• bù shuō tā le 不说他了 = (I’ll) not talk about it (anymore)

For function 2 (and maybe 1 also) they might just say:

• hǎo (le) 好(了) = good / ok

For function 3, they might say:

• fǎnzhèng 反正 = anyway / anyhow / in any case
• bùguǎn zěnme yàng 不管怎么样 = regardless of what happens / of what is

Does anyone have any insight into the problem of saying “anyway” in Chinese?

• The Informant
• HSK Vocabulary Levels Added to MDBG
• Language Learning is Messy I
• A Bit about Bù 不
• ChineseTeachers.com – My Review

I learned this word at lunch yesterday. Apparently most westerners have it, and not all Chinese do. The Chinese seem to think it’s a beautiful feature. Somehow, it doesn’t sound beautiful when I say it…oh well. Here’s some more info on the physiological phenomenon.

• HSK Vocabulary Levels Added to MDBG
• I’ll be Chewbacca, Hǎo bù hǎo?
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• Nciku.com – My Review
• Why Is Nǎlǐ 哪里 Written Wrong?

NEWS FLASH: They often just say tè 特

I just got fruit from one of my usual fruit dealers. The competition is so fierce between the fruit ladies that they usually throw in an extra apple or orange to try to secure my business for next time. Here’s how it went:

A = Albert
F = Fruit Lady

(F tries to give a free piece of hāmìguā 哈密瓜)

A: bú yào, xièxie 不要谢谢 = I don’t want it, thanks.

F: sòng gěi nǐ 送给你 = I’ll give it to you for free

A: bú yào, háishì yào xièxie nǐ 不要, 还是要谢谢 你 = I don’t want it, thanks anyway.

(F puts in the the bag)

F: zhège tè tián 这个特甜 = this one is especially sweet

But often they don’t use tèbié 特别 the way we would use “especially.” We say especially to mean, “in comparison to other things (usually just mentioned).” For example, “I saw 3 movies but I the the third one was especially good.”

The way I’m hearing it used is more like the way we say “really” or “SO.” I heard a student describe a lecture (not mine) as:

tè wúliáo 特无聊 = SO boring

Another student celebrated her triumph in killing a mosquito by calling it:

tèbié bèn 特别笨 = especially stupid

If anyone knows any rules for when you can say tè 特 and when you should say tèbié 特别, please leave a comment below.

• What’s up with Persuade?
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